I have no problem with atheists, or agnostics, though most have no idea what those words mean. What makes me nuts are the anti-theists, and the people who are so sure of their knowledge of “Organized religion” and the evils they contain. (often, those groups overlap)

yep.

I left a comment over at Marko’s place, and frankly, I’m too disgusted to go there and discuss anymore, lest my blood pressure be worse than it is.

Everyone is an expert on the Church, on Catholicism, on Christianity. Except not. Most of the people who spend most of their time denegrating the Church have no fucking clue what the fuck they’re talking about, period.

I’m gonna confine my statements here to the Catholic church, since it is the one I have 50 years of personal experience with, as a member, a seminarian, and a fledgeling theologian. I’m quite familiar with most other Christian sects, but just for now, let me talk Catholicism.

The worst old saw is that the Catholic church “Hides” priests who molest kids. This is the utterest bullshit that ever saw the light of day. The Catholic Church does no such thing, and has no such policy. There may be a few idiots who do things like this, and Catholics consider them with the same disdain they have for the guilty. The fact is, the Catholic Church has the first nationwide mandatory program for the prevention of molestation and abuse (Virtus) and all Catholic organizations and everyone who works with children in Catholic organizations MUST take the training which MANDATES a specific behavior which when implemented prevents this behavior. No other faith in America has this program or anything like it. And the incidence of molestation is at the same rate in the Catholic church as it is in other faiths, or other organizations, be it Boys club or YMCA or your local youth bowling league.

Well, it’s the organization, right? Organized religion is the problem, that’s it!

Don’t know what you’re smoking there, but the POINT of Christianity is to organize, and the Organization of the Catholic Church, that “Whore of babylon” as the calvinists love to call it, is responsible for a few things maybe you don’t know about. Millions of people in this “evil organized religion” spend a whole lot of their own free time and resources voluntarily supporting the community. Feeding the poor. Providing for the homeless. Caring for expectant mothers who choose to adopt rather than to abort. Doing what they can to make the world better for every single person- because that is what a Christian does. Because two people can do much more than one person, and a couple million people doing what they can to improve life for millions of other people, that takes organization, and the kind of organization it requires is what your local Catholic Priest is TRAINED TO DO. What do YOU do? me, I don’t do nearly enough, and I’m trying to change that- but the wife helps run the Bingo every monday, I help out at fundraisers, we do the things we can, because that’s what CHRISTIANS do. This is NOT the job of the government, and withot CHRISTIANS doing this, there would be a powerful lot more people falling through the cracks. In our parish alone, I know more than a few people whose lives are “Normal” instead of “Poverty stricken” because of the direct action of the Evil Organized Church. And because the Church helped them from falling through the cracks, they got their acts together and became helpers for OTHERS, and so on. Such is the nature of the “Evil organized religion”. Some parishes, the Church is the only thing between themselves and poverty.

This is not “just” the Catholic Church; this is also true of many, many Christian Churches, because it is the nature of Christianity to help. It is the case that the Catholic Church is the most well organized, and that has helped it to be able to do more for more than anyone else.

People “Claiming” to be Christian seldom do it 100% right. Some do it nearly 100% wrong. I’m a particular enemy of proselytizing; if i want you to join my faith, I will try to show you by my example how nice it is to be a member of my faith. I’d much rather earn your respect by treating you- and your beliefs- with respect. No, I won’t respect beliefs that are patently non-Christian. If you believe it’s ok to “Shun” people for not being the ‘Right’ kind of Christians, pardon me if I “Shun” you. If you think that Martin Luther or Calvin or Joseph Smith holds the keys to the kingdom of Christ, let me remind you, it was that guy- what was his name? Oh, yes, Jesus- who told Peter, the first Holy Father, “You are Peter, and on this rock I shall build my church, and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it’. That isn’t what makes you a Christian, though, you can be a baptist and be a great Christian just like you can be a Catholic and be less Christian than Carbon Tetrafloride, and vice versa.

Organization helps Christians do what they are called to do, better than they can do on their own. In any organization there are assholes. and all the people who are so anxious to throw out the baby and the bathwater because “organized religion is teh suxxors!!!” should maybe take a look at the individuals in the organization and then see what they think. There are 67.5 million Catholics in North America. If only ten percent of them are actual decent Christians, that means nearly seven million “evil organized religion followers” who would NOT be organized, working together, saving lives and improving lives and giving hope to people the world over.

Because of Organized religion.

yep. Fuck them. Real nice talk.