My god, this shit just fisks itself.
in the post about Obama below, I got a wondefully well thought out comment from “bonnieschlitz”.
I mean, I suppose she calls this thought. Witness:
And Og:
In your eloquent criticism of Senator Obama, you say, “the only people this [Socialism] will benefit are the ruling elites (him and his brethren).†Obviously you haven’t been taught by a Proper Pinko in an ideal, fully-funded public education institution. Because socialism does not reward the elite. In theory, it distributes wealth evenly among the people (hence the qualifier, SOCIAL). And socialism, as a viable alternative to capitalism, does not exist. (You can’t wave a magic wand and say “Presto! Socialism!†And you can’t become President and infect a country with it either.) So when you accuse Obama of playing to the elites, your fault lies in attempting to connect his “socialism†with his “elitismâ€â€“because you can’t have both. Either he’s for the people, or he’s for the elite. Which one is it? The “elitist†label doesn’t jive here either. But interestingly, if you wiki “Fascism†you’ll find this:
“a term used to describe authoritarian nationalist political ideologies or mass movements that are concerned with notions of cultural decline or decadence and seek to achieve a millenarian national rebirth by exalting the nation or race and promoting cults of unity, strength, and purity.â€
Hmmm…even more interesting when juxtaposed to the following quote from this blog post:
“We dislike Obama’s policies and what he stands for because without exception, everything he stands for is bad for America, bad for America’s people, and bad for the future of this great nation.â€
In that quote I see every indicator of what qualifies as fascism (at least to wikipedia)–nationalistic chest-pounding, an exalted purity of tradition, and a paranoid fear of cultural decline.
So, Og, my fellow cultural theorist and political analyst, in the words of TBird, and that hip, hip Lefty from Galilee, “Physician, heal thyself!â€
On another point, in no way does Obama (nor the policies he indicates) imply he favors statism. In fact, a few weeks ago, in Zanesville, Ohio, he described a plan for intensifying (not oppressively expanding) Bush’s faith-based and neighborhood-based initiatives. These organizations provide volunteer, charitable support for folks who, under the USUAL Lefty Entitlement Pattern, would be “enabled†(in both senses) by welfare programs. The government assists these faith and community-based organizations through grants, and the org’s also benefit from donations by the private sector. Because they’re relatively free of bureaucratic bullshit, and staffed by people who WANT to help, they’re more efficient and more cost-effective than any “socialist†entitlement program ever could be.
And, just to end my little rant here, in case you haven’t noticed, over the past 8 years (at least) the “little people†HAVE been paid lip service, industry HAS been crushed, and jobs HAVE disappeared. All while on the “conservative,†pro-capitalist, neoliberal, big industry time clock.
Luckily, I can still teach…for now.
The ivory tower ignorance drips forth like a fine, truffle laden gravy from a standing rib roast.
I may fisk this later, but at present I have a busy day ahead. Your mission, should you decide to accept it, is to expose the demonstrable fallacy in everything Bonnie says, from the mind numbing ignorance required to believe that Obama is incapable of attempting to impose socialism while playing to the elites (which is provably, demonstrably true for anyone with even a publik skool edumakation) to the media guided notion that the world is a faar worse place today because of evil Bushitlerchimpymchalliburton.
Sorry, Bonnie. You’ve drank so much of the Kool-Ade you have no idea you’re soaking in it. Try getting a job in the real world and seeing how life works. You know, where your “funding” depends on how good you are at your job.
As for this:
Luckily, I can still teach…for now
You’ve certainly taught me that my preconception of the abilities of the average public school teacher is…. well, it’s accurate as hell.
Fisk in comments or on your own blog. Pascal, I expect you to step up to the plate on this one.
15 comments Og | Uncategorized
Jesus wept- there’s someone on earth that stupid?
Indeed! I especially like the “fascism ” reference. As if Bonnie has any idea what “Fascism” means- or was supposed to mean:
http://neanderpundit.com/?p=2187
While simultaneously proving that her definition of “fascism” does not, and cannot apply to us evil “Neocons”. (she’s alive, isn’t she? If we were the “Fascists” she claims we are, she’d already be hanging from a Herndon, Virginia lamp post)
Now fellas, everyone has a right to an opinion.
Bonnie, I have older brothers that came home from WW2 and one that never made it home at all. I have no doubt that when you call these fellers fascists, you mean that as an insult.
Do you mean to insult me too? I’m just asking because my brothers knew what fascism was and they fought fascists with bayonets and rifles and not school yard name calling.
I am going to cancel your vote in the next election Bonnie. I think Obama is running on childish idealism that we cannot afford, and I think your lecture was proof of it.
Sorry for the rant evyone. Maybe I shouldn’t be too hard on this young person because there are grown men and women spouting this hogwash too.
“like a fine truffle laden gravy from a standing rib roast.”–for this metaphor, I am beyond flattered, gentlemen. Fisk away.
Points:
1.You mistakenly assume that I locate the problems of the world within the evil Bush…burton/neocon conspiracy. I do not. They are a symptom, not the virus itself. You are not neocons. If you were, you wouldn’t be so boisterous.
ed:I don’t mistakenly assume anything. If I assume anything, I do so because I understand what “facts” are.
2.You imply teaching is not a “real job.” Interesting. And I am a low-level instructor at a public university. I do not have much power to share my kool-aid. By the way, I spent 6 years managing a successful small business before returning to the ivory tower. I spent formative younger years before that working stock (loading and unloading trucks) for a minor mass-retail chain. I have performed social work with DSM-IV diagnosed children–by far the most challenging thing I have ever done. I have had “real jobs” in the past, know what it’s like to live in my car, and even today, while still taking classes and teaching, I have a full-time job outside the skool from 1-10pm. So please refrain from assuming I am your stereotypical tower damsel. I read Hegel, drink Pabst, listen to Skynyrd, AND write manifestos.
I don’t “Imply” anything. Project much? When you can be fired if your students fail, come back. Until then, of course, what I state is true. I read and discarded Hegel as trash when I was 11. No normal human deliberately drinks PBR. And so did Ted Kaczynski
3. I never said you are fascists. I said your comments show the first bloody spots of a fascist infection.
Wow, that’s the most interesting backpedaling equivocation I ever heard. You used “fascist” regarding a comment I made, when you clearly have no idea what it actually means, and now you retract it but not really. Please do a little research and tell me who “fascists” are. Better yet, tell me what most “fascists” were, that ought to blow your mind if you’re intelligent enough to find out.
4. “I mean, I suppose she calls this thought.”–Do you insult all your guests before calling your troops to take aim?
Like you, I must go to work now. I look forward to checking in on my fate…
postscript to Rusty:
I do not mean anything as an insult. I thank your loved ones for their service. Those were difficult and different times, as I have heard from my own grandfather. And I volunteer registering voters on the weekends. You know, young, idealistic folks participating in the political process for the first time, who prefer blade-sharp words to howitzers, and who are likely voting for Obama? I will register my first 10 in your name tomorrow.
Ed: Doesn’t matter what you do, Bonnie, Virginia is a red state. Obama will lose there, so you’re wasting your time doing something ideological, and typically, ignorant.
My two cents:
Because socialism does not reward the elite. In theory, it distributes wealth evenly among the people (hence the qualifier, SOCIAL).
Dear, in theory there’s no difference between theory and practice, but in practice, there is.
Can you show me one socialist system that does not benefit the elites and whose “distribution” of wealth results in a higher standard of living that what results under capitalism?
I don’t believe that any of the classics socialist systems (Soviet, Cuban, any of the African ones, etc) can pass those two tests. I don’t know if Norway’s socialism benefits the elites, but I know it lowers the people’s standard of living.
The socialism that Mr. Obama advocates is the classic kind: taking from the poor benighted people who haven’t the wits to look after themselves to allow their betters to correct their behavior and choices by economic control. It fails both of the above tests.
And Og isn’t “calling on his troops to take aim.” He’s taking advantage of an excellent opportunity for his friends to engage in a stimulating intellectual exercise. I imagine you do that all the time with your students as opportunity presents, though maybe not with political topics.
Nicely done, weet. Why don’t you have your own blog again?
Bonnie. Whatever your past experiences, you have managed not to see the rotting false facade that is socialism. It is, and maybe always has been, the front to provide progressives the wedge issues they needed to climb to power — thus allowing them to become elitists. Don’t you see why Og and other critics say that yet? And it is true for members of both major parties.
Were you today to begin habitually thinking ostensible socialism, it may provide you the antidote to whatever kool-aid you have been fed. Success depends much on your ability to tie negative consequences to our buying from fantasy peddlers.
Another thing. Is it true that you mostly base your belief that Bush is a right winger because he’s a Republican and because he’s engaged in war?
You must be new here to think Og believes Bush is a Rightist.
Well and precisely put as always, Pascal.
A “teacher” who uses wikipedia as her source material? Man is that reassuring…
Every generation has its useful fools Bonnie, and I have no doubt that you can assemble quite a few of them. Those razor sharp words cut like knives too. But cuts are nothing, morals and logic are all.
I am still going to cancel your vote, and hopefully the fellers can do the same with your impressionable idealistic first time voters.
One way or another it is going to be an educational experience for everyone.
Well Bonnie, you let me have it…Cool.
I’d like to inform you that I too was once a teacher. Straight out of the University into a classroom teaching high school biology because, at the time, jobs in my chosen profession were hard to come by.
Part of it I liked. Part I didn’t. What annoyed me the most was that the administration informed me that, though they could run interference for a while, if I was going to make it a career, I’d have to go back to school and earn a teaching certificate. So, I’d have to spend another year or more to earn the necessary credits to certify that I was qualified to teach what I was already teaching. I got the hell out. I later went on to spend 15 years as a Fire Service Field Instructor but that’s another matter.
As to the “commie” curriculum, it ain’t commie. What it is is increasingly watered down to accommidate interests that feel they’re being neglected to the point that high school students are being denied the fundamental subject matter they need to exist in the real world.
Universities are not much different. Tuition goes up as Universities seek to meet the diverse needs of their students rather than the specific needs of the their future employers. This is okay as long as YOU are willing to pay for it and accept the consequences. It’s a bit disconcerting to find that your BA in Ethnic Studies has about one fifth the earning power as your roomie’s BS in Chemical Engineering.
Here is a prime example of how blind you can be.
Socialist elites positively hate the two most efficient community based organizations in America because they refuse to fall in line behind the “progressive” agenda.
The Boy Scouts and The Salvation Army are denied public access, forced to reduce their services, and compelled to waste otherwise well-used funds to defend themselves in court because of “socialist” self-assessed superiority.
Bonnie, I’ve been away from the ivory tower for over 40 years, so may I please be excused for noting that your expository prose is not written in any recognized expository style?
Perhaps there has been a new style of expository prose recognized, under the sub-heading of “rant prose”, where it is appropriate to string sentences together, start sentences with “Because” and commit other writer’s sins.
Please tell me you teach Physical Education or some non-intellectual course. I would hate to consider the damage already done if you were a teacher of English, or whatever passes these days for language instruction in one’s native language.
“Nicely done, weet. Why don’t you have your own blog again?”
Too lazy and undependable. What energy and reliability I have, my family has first claim on.