faith
No, not the George Michael song, but the real thing.
Tam suggests I’ve tortured logic to prove that faith and belief are different things. This is not my assertion, but the plain and simple fact, I’m just trying to find a clear way to express it- maybe Webster will have better luck at that than I.
From: Websters new Synonym Dictionary, 1973:
A DICTIONARY
OF
DISCRIMINATED SYNONYMS
WITH ANTONYMS AND
ANALOGOUS AND CONTRASTED WORDS
The technical difference between “Faith” and “Belief” is pretty clear- it’s not like, in 1973, people were that much more thoughtful than they are now, but at least by then, the slow campaign of dumbing down the language had not yet reached it’s current state.
(Click to embiggenate)
Now, reading the definition, as it stands, it’s easy to make the assumption that faith and belief are similar enough to be indistinguishable. “Someone told you about Jesus/Mahomet/the Flying Spaghetti monster, and you believed it, and that’s your faith”.
Erm, no. This is the anti-theists explanation for just about everything.
To people with no faith, faith and belief are the same thing. To people with Faith, there is clearly a difference.
Belief is widespread, and therefore common- common not in the “Widespread” use of the word, but common in this use oif the word:
6: hackneyed; trite.
7: of mediocre or inferior quality; mean; low: a rough-textured suit of the most common fabric.
8: coarse; vulgar: common manners.
Faith is rare, and therefore not common, in those same senses of the word.
On Easter Sunday, I pray for all that come here to read that Faith comes to you, as it has come to me.Faith does not exist in the world for you to become holier-than-thou, if so it certainly has not worked on me. Faith just does an excellent job of making the rest of creation make a lot more sense.
Much thanks to old friend Pascal for finding this and scanning it for me from his personal collection.
31 comments Og | Uncategorized
I’ve felt fear in an airplane, shooting an approach to minimums in the mountains, snowflakes the size of postage stamps slamming into the window, my right hand on the throttle and sweat trickling down my cheek. I had never felt more present, more myself, more in the moment than at that time. The fear was right on the edge of either paralyzing me or propelling me into this place of being utterly engaged, that magic moment when I know I am honing years of practice into precision flying, and I’m suddenly out of the fear, into the light. I could manage the fear because I have faith. Faith in my training, faith in my mechanic, my copilot, my airplane. Faith IS a belief, but it’s not a blind belief, it’s the confident belief in the truth of a person or thing.
So, I simply had faith that with needles centered, the runway should soon be straight ahead. For as it says in Hebrews 11:1 faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
Happy Easter Og
Brigid
Well put, Og.
Happy Easter to you!
Happy Easter, all.
My belief is that Jesus rose from the dead.
My faith is in Him to do the same for me.
Great post. Thanks.
Ed: Can you tell me why you believe jesus rose from the dead? And can you tell me how that belief benefits you? if someone else believes Jim Jones was the Messiah, how is it that their belief can be wrong, and yours right? Or is yours right? Belief is tawdry. I pray that your beliefs fall away from you like scales from a blind man’s eyes, because that’s what they are, for you. Artifices there to keep you from the truth.
As for “Faith that Jesus will do the same for you”- Tell me, how can I also know what Jesus has planned for me, the way you know what he has planned for you?
Faith is not what your sunday school teacher told you you should believe.
hey, Travis! When you gonna have a blog back up?
Interesting thoughts all.
I am a product of the ‘modern’ world…my mom is Protestant, my dad is Jewish…they split the difference by raising us in a very Commercial Manner. We did Easter Eggs, and had matzoh. We had a Christmas Tree/Hanukkah Shrub, and lit candles on the menorah.
I addressed this earlier today on my blog. My wife is more religious than I am, and I go to church with her, and participate as actively as I am able to give her the respect and support she deserves as my wife. If my girls come to have Faith in Jesus, I will not be upset.
Myself…I feel I was raised a bit too Jewish to ever really have either faith/and or belief in the ‘Jesus Story’. I am not calling it a story to be offensive, and hope it is not coming across that way…but to someone lacking in Faith, such as myself, it is a story…and a story told just as well by Andrew Lloyd Weber in Jesus Christ Superstar as it is by The Disciples in The Gospels.
In a way, I am jealous of people that have this True Faith…I am jealous of the ‘rudder’ they have to guide them, and the hope that that gives them for the future.
That doesn’t stop me from wishing everyone a Happy Easter Sunday…but then, the right thing to do is wish everyone a Happy Day EVERY DAY, isn’t it?
Greg:
I’ve had that discussion with an awful lot of people.
The faith you are thinking of, is right at your fingertips. You only have to choose it.
People talk about their faith leaving them, That doesn’t happen; you leave your faith. From the sounds of things, you have it in spades, you just don’t know it.
This is the problem I have with “belief” on it’s face. People look at their local pastor, or priest, and see the way they act, and think, that must be faith. It’s not. It may be belief, but I have little use for that, it’s a facade. it’s a face that people put forth to convince others how holy they are,
Faith doesn’t require that facade; faith is the very substance, and once you understand it, you don’t have any need, anymore, for the facade.
If we’re gonna do this right, I want a moderator.
That moderator would have to be a fool to step in, or “rush in” if you get the reference.
I am convinced by a preponderance of evidence that Jesus rose from the dead. Men who feared for their lives later gave their lives convinced they had seen Him alive after His death as one evidence of many.
I did not always have this belief, this world view, understanding of reality, paradigm. I formerly believed the opposite, that Jesus was a nut case.
When I accepted this evidence that Jesus had beaten death, I reviewed what He had to say about how to beat death.
I put faith in him to be telling me the truth.
My faith is in a person. What I think of that person is belief.
If someone believes Jim Jones is the Messiah and I believe Jesus is the Messiah, one of us (or both) is wrong. But we can’t both be right. BTW: There is no evidence Jones rose from the dead. Plenty Jesus did.
The guy that followed Jones drank the kool-aid. Not a good thing.
Belief is not tawdry. Belief is how we navigate the world. It’s our construct of reality.
Belief is the map we travel the road with.
Faith is our trust in the facts we know to build that map. As Brigid said: “it’s the confident belief in the truth of a person or thing.”
My faith in Jesus is where I stop calling Him a liar and accept Him at His Word (always a good thing when dealing with God).
You misquoted me in your reply. I didn’t say I know what Jesus has planned for you, but for me: Raise me from the dead.
If you really want to know what He has planned for you, ask Him.
But if He’s dead, don’t expect a reply.
BTW: If you pray that my belief falls away, who are you praying to?
I didn’t have Sunday School teachers. I had catechism and nuns. But what makes your opinion more valid than theirs, or mine?
Are you the Messiah?
Done yanking my chain yet?
The one I had the most difficulty was between having faith and religion. That was tough until I learned faith, then it was clear.
“Done yanking my chain yet? ”
When I yank your chain, Ed, you’ll know it.
I’m not the messiah.
I’m trying to show you that neither is anyone else. Except, of course, the Messiah. Anyone who tries to school you on what you should “believe” is the buddha; kill him.
graybeard: Yep.
Ed was yanking your chain, not I. At least not this paul.
Sorry! lol. I’m a little easter-inebriated. Fixed.
Annnyway, Happy Easter, Og, & readers.
I’m with Brigid. And St. Thomas. “Lord, I believe. Help my unbelief.”
Joan, you’ll figure this out, eventually.
The bible is full of mentions of “belief”. The Aramaic (Well, as close as I can do it here) is”Nynmyht”which is a word in Aramaic that seems to be used interchageably for “belief” and “Faith”. You can find a good peshitta translation at many bookstores, or go online here and read:
http://www.peshitta.org/
The word “belief” has been so diluted and tweaked over the years that it has no meaningful meaning, and the harder I look the more I dislike it. And “faith” itself is starting to be diluted as well.
No porblem. I had assumed error over intention.
“Joan, you’ll figure this out, eventually. ”
Why, how grand of you, Og.
;)
I’m not being a smartass, nor am I being condescending. I know that you’re bright enough that you’ll eventually come to the same conclusions that I have, because you keep your eyes open, and you think.
I’ve also come to the conclusion- as have many before me- that trying to drag someone away from their deeply held
‘beliefs” is like pulling a rotting molar out of an alert and annoyed warthog. Very few will stop chafing at the bonds of their own preconceptions and open their eyes and look around, and see what the reality is.
The way it was explained to me, when I first came to faith (and if I understand you correctly I’m using that word correctly) in Christ, was that if I’m watching someone ride a unicycle on a tightrope, I may believe he’ll reach the other side in safety. Faith means I’m willing to climb up on his shoulders. I know that if I’m wrong I’m lost, but I also know I’m not wrong, and I’m not lost.
Try this on for size: If you “believe” Jesus is The Christ, and someone else does not, which belief is valid?
“I know that you’re bright enough that you’ll eventually come to the same conclusions that I have,”
How do you know I wasn’t already there light years ahead of you?
You’re not a smartass, dear, you’re just another arrogant engineer! Everyone else’s processing of information is inefficient and in need of adjustment. With a hammer. Always.
It’s your way. If I didn’t like it, I wouldn’t hang around.
:o)
Joan, you still miss my point, but I’m not concerned, one way or another. And while I do the work of an engineer, I’m not one, not technically, anyway.
Hardly anyone else is capable of processing information, demonstrably. This is not a prejudice I have, but a proveable fact. Example: Who is our president?
Hardly anyone else is capable of processing information, demonstrably.
I have NEVER missed your point, I assure you.
Og
I know exactly what you are driving at–
“What do you believe?”
“I believe what the Church believes.”
“What does the Church believe?”
“The Church believes what I believe.”
Quite different from “faith” proper.
Fifteen years of the Holy Ministry and the ten years getting there . . . yeah, I understand.
But I think you are putting too much effort on the word-play. Next Sunday features St. Thomas, and Joan made the telling point. Scripture uses “faith” and “belief” in interchangeable fashion. That that has been bastardized by whomever, whenever, is rightly a concern, and you have rightly put attention to it, but I would suggest an alternative to the “belief” you decry . . .
“What I feel.”
That is far closer to what it is you are describing, and, unfortunately, far deadlier to those who rely merely upon their feelings.
And it is manifestly obvious in the “success” churches, sad to say.
Peace.
The problem is that “belief” has been co-opted by evil people, not that it has become weakened, like “i feel” but that it has become strengthened- in the wrong direction, for the enemies of good, against us.
But yeah, I think you’re on the wavelength, JB. Brigid, above, uses “Faith” and “belief” in the pure and original manner. Pretty much everyone else uses “belief” as a weapon.
“Try this on for size: If you “believe†Jesus is The Christ, and someone else does not, which belief is valid?”
I think (as Dad would have said) we’re now getting down to where the cheese binds.
The simple answer would be that my “belief” is valid because it’s consistent with truth. The more complete answer is that it doesn’t matter, truth doesn’t require anyone to acknowledge it, it simply is. If every Christian were to be murdered, if teaching Christianity were completely stopped, if there were not one person left on Earth who had ever even HEARD of Jesus or God, if no one even knew what the word “Christ” meant anymore, that wouldn’t alter that fact in the slightest.
“is valid because it’s consistent with truth.”
Your truth. The other person’s belief is valid because it’s consistent with their truth. That person has arguments against your truth just as compelling as your arguments for it.
So, if I agree with Brigid, but invite a bit of wordplay with the example of St. Thomas, I have yet to figure something out?
Please point out where I indicated anything other than what I clearly stated.
;)